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Post by Arivis on Nov 19, 2005 10:44:53 GMT -5
This war in Iraq proves to me that money is more important than life. We are there to establish stabilty and provide support to help them establish a government that is pro-American but in the course of doing this many sacrifices are being made. In many situations there has to be some sacrifice but lives are being lost. I feel for the families that have lost a loved one. Sacrifice......to what end ? My dad was in Vietnam and lost friends. I did happen to see a video on the Internet some time ago about Nick Berg who was beheaded...terrible tragedy. I was wondering if anyone had any opinions on what was going on overseas.
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Post by crazycat on Nov 19, 2005 15:26:49 GMT -5
I heard that the Nick Berg video was a fake thing and to me it did look fake. My opinion is that there is so much that is put out there that is just fake political junk and it's hard to really know what to believe about the situation.
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Post by andin on Dec 3, 2005 20:45:36 GMT -5
I'm a libertarian and tend to get a little vocal with my political opinions, but I am also ex-military (Army) so I sometimes find myself at odds with situations like this. On the one hand I am totally against the war in general. We have been in a place we shouldn't have gone to in the first place for way too long. On the other hand we did go. It would be irresponsible to help destroy a country and not help rebuild it. It's more of a principle thing than a political opinion. Also I have to support the military troops that are there regardless of whether I believe in the mission or not. Yes they volunteered for the position knowing full well that at any time during their time in they could be called up to participate in a wartime mission. I knew that it could have been possible when I went in and I was prepared for it if necessary. However, they do not have a choice as to what mission they are sent to or for how long they will be there. Just my opinion.
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Post by zayin on Dec 3, 2005 20:52:13 GMT -5
This war in Iraq proves to me that money is more important than life. To some unfortunatly it is... We are there to establish stabilty and provide support to help them establish a government that is pro-American ... IS that the reason?
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Post by Arivis on Dec 23, 2005 7:13:57 GMT -5
I received this email...seems very poignant to me....
To Kill an American
You probably missed it in the rush of news last week, but there was actually a report that someone in Pakistan had published in a newspaper an offer of a reward to anyone who killed an American, any American.
So an Australian dentist wrote an editorial the following day to let everyone know what an American is . so they would know when they found one. (Good one, mate!!!!)
"An American is English, or French, or Italian, Irish, German, Spanish, Polish, Russian or Greek. An American may also be Canadian, Mexican, African, Indian, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, Australian, Iranian, Asian, or Arab, or Pakistani or Afghan.
An American may also be a Comanche, Cherokee, Osage, Blackfoot, Navaho, Apache, Seminole or one of the many other tribes known as native Americans.
An American is Christian, or he could be Jewish, or Buddhist, or Muslim. In fact, there are more Muslims in America than in Afghanistan. The only difference is that in America they are free to worship as each of them chooses.
An American is also free to believe in no religion. For that he will answer only to God, not to the government, or to armed thugs claiming to speak for the government and for God.
An American lives in the most prosperous land in the history of the world. The root of that prosperity can be found in the Declaration of Independence, which recognizes the God given right of each person to the pursuit of happiness.
An American is generous. Americans have helped out just about every other nation in the world in their time of need, never asking a thing in return.
When Afghanistan was over-run by the Soviet army 20 years ago, Americans came with arms and supplies to enable the people to win back their country!
As of the morning of September 11, Americans had given more than any other nation to the poor in Afghanistan. Americans welcome the best of everything...the best products, the best books, the best music, the best food, the best services. But they also welcome the least.
The national symbol of America, The Statue of Liberty, welcomes your tired and your poor, the wretched refuse of your teeming shores, the homeless, tempest tossed. These in fact are the people who built America. Some of them were working in the Twin Towers the morning of September 11, 2001 earning a better life for their families. It's been told that the World Trade Center victims were from at least 30 different countries, cultures, and first languages, including those that aided and abetted the terrorists. So you can try to kill an American if you must. Hitler did. So did General Tojo, and Stalin, and Mao Tse-Tung, and other blood-thirsty tyrants in the world. But, in doing so you would just be killing yourself. Because Americans are not a particular people from a particular place. They are the embodiment of the human spirit of freedom. Everyone who holds to that spirit, everywhere, is an American.
Please keep this going!
Pass this around the World ?
then pass it around again.
It says it all, for all of us
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Post by andin on Dec 26, 2005 20:41:42 GMT -5
That was awesome! Thanks for putting it here!
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Post by crazycat on Dec 27, 2005 15:16:29 GMT -5
I meant to let you know that was a cool post as well. I even copy and pasted and sent it to several friends. Thanks for sharing that.
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Post by mandala on Mar 1, 2006 19:17:41 GMT -5
I was wondering if anyone had any opinions on what was going on overseas. I just noticed this thread, and yes I do have some opinions. I was against the Iraqi invasion from the beginning because I don't believe anything the neo-conservatives say. I didn't buy the argument of WMD and an eminent threat. The neo-conservative movement is all about global domination and control of the world's natural resouces (namely oil). The Bush administation and the archetects of the neo-conservative movement---including among them Dick Cheney, and Donald Rumsfeld---KNEW there were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, so they knew it would be an easy target for invasion. It's a country with an abundance of oil, it's location is strategic in that it sits in the middle of the Middle East, and as Bush said, (Saddam) "tried to kill my dad." The WMD argument was used solely to sell the war to the public. Former Deputy Sec. of Defense Paul Wolfowitz admitted to as much in a Newsweek interview.
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Post by Dancing Bear on Mar 7, 2006 3:20:29 GMT -5
A lot of us in OZ, I can't speak for everyone, But most believed it was a War for Oil using WMD as a front and knew they would never be found. I think it could have been done differently( Maybe i watch too much TV ) But think A hit squad could have been sent in secratly and wasted the SOB Saddam and his Sons for their treatment of the people. So On the note of the Husseins terrorizing their own people warrent them being forcebly removed. What i dont like and probably is facts of War but still hard to come to terms with is the Innocent that perish. I just imagine What if it were my country that was being overturned, how would i feel if one of my kids was accidently blown up by freindly fire.... its really a hard one to comment. Because there are so many fors and againsts.
Lets put it this way i would hate to be there!!!
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Post by epona on Mar 7, 2006 10:16:47 GMT -5
Greetings. As a former military member and the current wife of an active duty chief in the navy, this is a subject close to my heart. I agree that the excuses given for entering the war were pretty lame, we are there and now must make the best of a bad thing. So many have lost lives, loved ones, and friends that we now must stop arguing about what to do and just do something. We should make tracks in restoring basic necessities, help them get their feet under them then get the heck out. The biggest concern I have now is the threat of civil war. We should not be part of that process. Get out while the getting is good and let them fight it out amoungst their selves. We have no place in a civil war situation. We have done what we can, now they need to learn to stand on their own and move on. The people of that region of the world have been around for thousands of years and they will be around many more, be it fighting amongst themselves or their neighbors. It is what their mindsets are. We can not change that or them. I do support the troops. They are doing what they are required to do. They, for the most part, are making the best of a bad situation. Please, no matter your feeling towards the war, support the troops! Thanks for letting me ramble.
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Post by bezjak on Mar 7, 2006 11:16:24 GMT -5
Should there even be a reason good enough to kill others of our species? Destroying to rebuild? And rebuild what, another version of the United States? If that's what we're "gunning" for then my friends in the end only death will come from this, perpetuating the problem at hand. Not being able to communicate with each other for we are blinded by our political stance. Or religious one. There are some things worth sacrificing, but in that there is a new beginning for all of us. We must change the way we think of shedding blood. This is "human" sacrifice we are speaking of....that is only called for by the Gods.
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Post by Dancing Bear on Mar 12, 2006 2:27:07 GMT -5
Here Here Bezjak !
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Post by sxy on Mar 20, 2006 2:37:54 GMT -5
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Post by Arivis on Mar 21, 2006 3:59:09 GMT -5
Another thought I would like to add is that no matter what, I don't think there will ever be a utopia here on earth. It seems to be within our nature to fight as human beings, unfortunately.
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Post by bezjak on Mar 22, 2006 12:38:09 GMT -5
But knowing we are warriors by nature is no excuse to kill one another, the very nature of our being is to conquer yet we have already conquered this world, why not use it (earth) to its full potential....and unlock our destiny,for the ancient have left us keys to who we are, and have shown us better ways to manage this world then we are doing now. Our precious resources are the only true legacy are elders have left us on this planet, that and the knowledge the we as a whole have collected individually. The ancients studied the stars for a reason.....yet this is something I would have to tell you face to face.
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Post by mandala on Mar 22, 2006 20:47:38 GMT -5
why not use it (earth) to its full potential....and unlock our destiny,for the ancient have left us keys to who we are, and have shown us better ways to manage this world then we are doing now. I think the human race is still evolving. Our species is still in the infantile phase. That amphibian part of our brain has evolved, but the higher brain functions in the cerebral cortex still needs a few more electric pathways. Scientists have said we only use between 10 to 20 percent of our brain. We won't be around to see it, but it would be interesting to see what we will accomplish as a species if we had the capacity to use 100%. We would either have a utopia type paradise, or arrmageddon.
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Post by bezjak on Mar 23, 2006 14:31:21 GMT -5
But honestly to produce an utopia we would have to manage our natural resources alot better right? Stop fighting for them and just share them, one land or country cannot survive when its young are being sacrificed from needlessly fought war. Our future as a species now lies in our hands, you know as well as I do that "these" regimes will not stop fighting until "all" wells are dry, and in the mean time our world is dying a slow death. Poisoned, dammed, and altered. We are left to wonder what all the preservatives are doing to us. Why our live stock are pumped full of growth hormones, and what are the effects of this on our children? Sure Armageddon could be an alternative where only the stongest survive and the weak are slautghered but isn't that what we have now?
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Post by Dancing Bear on Mar 24, 2006 4:03:05 GMT -5
I am totally with you here Bezjak!! We have done enough damage its time to bring the soldiers home. And stop fighting like Bully's in the school yard, and start working as a whole. But can the human race ever do that? It would be nice if we as a race Agreed to disagree at times. Instead of trying to conquer and destroy because of difference, or just merely because another country has something we would like. We try to teach our children to share nicely, do not fight and argue try to come to a compromise. Be nice to those who are different, because we are all equal regardless race or religion or the depth of our pockets. Are we not contradicting ourselves, Are we teaching our children it's Ok! to be a Bully and fight and argue, Kill and Destroy when they become Adults..It does mean you are different if your religion is different or your colouring is different or your pockets are deeper or dont exsist at all. Do as I say not as I do!! I'm afraid that is not equality, we are belittling our children, making them feel like they are below us by dictating what they can and can't do. Yet we do as we like!!! No wonder the Generations are confused, and yet do the same thing to their children. We need to stop the cycle, become cyclebreakers. Lead by example teach our children well. Love thy Neighbour, An Old Indian belief is what we do today will affect the next 7 generations to come. I truly beleive it!! My ancestors started from 5 generations ago started to live naturally and became very Spiritual with the Earth. I am part of the result and my Children will be even more educated & evolved. Monkey see Monkey do!!! As your little signature says Mandala.. War Good God Ya'll!! What is is good for . Absolutely Nothing!!!! Exactly!!!!
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Post by animal on Mar 27, 2006 11:27:55 GMT -5
Some interesting reading for anyone interested.
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Post by section8 on Mar 28, 2006 12:24:11 GMT -5
I just think the media has poisoned everyone's minds with it's ability to twist anything that happens to what people want to hear, humanity screwing up, conspiracy and controversy.
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