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Post by Dancing Bear on Aug 6, 2006 17:03:56 GMT -5
I watched a pretty good Movie last night. I think it was called Rising the APheonix ( I am not well so a bit groggy) But I do remember a scene in it that really made my ears prick up... An Arabian fellow was painting on the side of the aircraft they were building in the middle of the Gobi desert.. He painted PHEONIX.. It was explained what it was about the Egyptian bird of fire.. anyway, somebody said to him.. So what is your religion about? He replied I am NO religion. Religion divides people, I practice spirituality and Being Spiritual unites me with myself and Everyone else.. I thought this was a great statement in light of what is happening in the world at the moment... It was a statement that made a bit of an impact on the ole brain cells  Anyway I thought i would share it.. Have a great day all! DB XXX |
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blank
Diviner
There is a little bad in the best of us and a little good in the worst of us
Posts: 258
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Post by blank on Aug 6, 2006 18:53:15 GMT -5
Oh I like that and agree whole heartly, thats one thing that I've never understood about churches. If they are all worshipping the same god, use the same bible then why do they divide themselves into sects
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Silver MoonWolf
Conjurer
Merry Meet And Merry Part, Until We Merry Meet Again!
Posts: 147
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Post by Silver MoonWolf on Aug 7, 2006 7:18:27 GMT -5
Yep, that is why I have never been much of one for conventional religion, 100 people read the same book and you get 100 different relgions that form out of it.
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Post by elvinlady on Aug 7, 2006 11:36:35 GMT -5
I think I have seen that movie to. That statement is so true.
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Post by crazycat on Aug 7, 2006 14:08:01 GMT -5
The way I see it...it isn't the religions themselves that divides, it is the people that are practicing those religions. We always look for something outside ourselves to put the blame on. Religions groups are no different than clubs, gangs, etc. In fact, the people that are in clubs and gangs are more likely to put themselves above those who do not belong to their group than so religious group person. The way I see it, there is more likely to be more people practcing spirituality in some religious group than there would be in some social club or gang related group. Just my humbel opinion.
People from time one have divided themselves into this country or that country, this club or that club, this gang or that, this religin or that, etc. It is people themselves who do the dividing. Shall we have a "one world order" or kept our freedom to follow the path of our own chosing? By putting the blame on those religious groups aren't you putting yourselves above them as better than they? They are people too who are in the same boat, who are following their own beliefs/path. Who are we too said they are wrong and place all the world woes onto them?
The truth is we are all the same and think our way is the right way and when we think we are right and they are wrong that is what divides.
I'll get off my soap box now. LOL! ;D
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Diviner
There is a little bad in the best of us and a little good in the worst of us
Posts: 258
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Post by blank on Aug 10, 2006 1:32:05 GMT -5
aye well this forum is fulla anomilies like wise women for instance... na joking
Well I can see your point but aren't the people praticing the religion the ones who create it and make it real? maybe pimping girls and selling drugs just isn't their style, I feel that the statement about sprituality would be the most profound. If those who pratisced religion (and I know there are those who do this) did it for the puropse of spritualility then religion wouldn't divide. Now maybe I have been really unlucky in the many churches that I have been in but I see the basic breakdown of:
People who are the zealous one intent on destroying those who oppose them
People who are well off and really don't care about anyone else
so maybe I am a bit bitter about religion; I can understand how satanism got started, before the blood drinking and murder it was essientially a religion based on honesty... well Crazy plz get back on your soap box it's is very stimulating to read your responses
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Post by Dancing Bear on Aug 10, 2006 1:51:51 GMT -5
Yes get back up your soap box CC, we like you there  I do like your rantings coz it gives food for thought even though i would like to disagree also.. I think the Bible is one of the best horror story's out... They were viscious towards those whose did not beleive nor conform.. and it was written what to do to those who did not conform.. I had to put the King James bible down it was horrific.. I do agree not all religions that are written preach any violence nor segregation.. I think it matters how the written religion is interpreted.. A lot is taken literallly. But then who is to say it originally wasnt meant to be that way.... I do not expect all to be like me there can only be one GOD.. ;D |
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Post by michael on Aug 10, 2006 2:34:19 GMT -5
The funny thing I had a dream about the Pheonix. It was my strongest spell.
Yes I think i've watched this movie. It's a good one.
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Post by osiris on Aug 10, 2006 13:57:20 GMT -5
could not have said that better. religion divides. Thanks Michael ill have to check out the film. Hmmm its weird there is a occult belief that the phoenix is used by a group of powerful women in government right now. Also was originally going to be in the place of the eagle for our country. Rebirth or reserection is what the phoenix stands for.
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Post by crazycat on Aug 10, 2006 17:41:13 GMT -5
;D I guess I will get back on the old soap box for a spell. hehe......since you asked for it. First off, all religions are man made and are formed to promote some group of people's ideals. None of them are God made. Some are formed to promote spirituality and service to their community and then there are others formed to to serve and promote some power hunger person or group of people's cause. It boils down to the wheat and the tares being allowed to grow up along side each other until the time of the harvest/ascension. All groups rather they are a religious group, political group, social club, gang, country, government, etc., all create division. That is what all groups do: cut and divide. It is not a charactistic of religious groups only. That has been mankinds nature form the time Adam became unsatisfied with what God provided and became power hungry for more. From that time we have been living in a world or duality. The word duality means division. Yes, Dancing Bear, the bible does have a lot of volience and horror written within it's pages for it is the history of mankind, but it is also the story about the great love of our Creator God who loved us unconditionally and interviened in our self destructive ways and provide a means of saving us from our own self destruction. It is very sad that you laid your bible aside before you realized that amongst all that volience and horror committed by mankind that it is in fact, the greatest love story ever told. Some groups that are formed are corrupt from the beginning, some become corrupt later, but then there are some groups that are formed to serve their commuinty and they continuing in their purpose rather it be a religion or what ever the group labels itself. Have you ever heard of a gang or social club that is formed soully for the purpose of performing some service to the whole community? I haven't. These types of groups are formed to serve themselves and their members only. Granted, not all religious groups are formed to be of service to others either. And I'm not saying that there are not some service to others types people involved with or belong to some of those service to self groups. I'm just saying that it is more likely for a religious group to be formed for the purpose of service to others over say a gang, social club; such types as those. It just irks me that the powers that be are using the media to put down all religious groups as thought they are the soul cause of all the world's woes. The fact is, that there are many, many religious groups out there whose members go out and donate their time and goods to help feed the hungry, provide the homeless a place to sleep, visit the sick and those in prison to give them comfort. After Katrina happened there were more religious/church organizations and their people out there giving a helping hand and sure as hell did more for those people than the corrupt Red Cross and Fema did for them. For instants, the Goodwill organization stepped in and help themselves to goods donated for those people and sent it all over sea and made themselves a good profit from it all. Anyways, the way I see it there are many more spiritual people in a religious group than there are in some gang, social culb or political group. How many teenagers in gang related groups do you know who would give up a whole week of their time to go pack boxes of rice to send to the needy? There are many young people who do things such as that all the time in church/religious related groups. Also, just because a group labels themself as religious and God centered, does not mean they truly are. As for Blanks statement about why there are so many sects if they are studying the same bible and worshiping the same God. That is simple, because religions are created by man not God. Look at how many so called "spiritual" sects there are. Just because they use the word spiritual rather than religious does not make them any different except in their own eyes. They still have a set of ritual and rules they live by rather they belong to an organized group or not. There can be just as much corruption within a "spiritual group" as there are in any other. Have you ever looked up both definitions in the dictionery? Both words mean pretty much the same thing. They are both labels mankind has concocted to further divide. It's just that the word spiritual is an in word right now because the word religious has been given a bad rap through the media by the powers that be. Shit! Give it another 10 years or so and it will probably go a complete circle and the word spiritual will be looked as bad and the word religious will be the in thing.  With that I will get off my soap box... with one last statment or two. Be careful what you allow the media (the powers and principalities) to program into you minds. Hehe... as David Icke has said, they produce the problems and then provide the solutions, all for the purpose of their own profit at the exspense of us pinions. |
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blank
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There is a little bad in the best of us and a little good in the worst of us
Posts: 258
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Post by blank on Aug 12, 2006 21:52:25 GMT -5
Well you get bonus points for the rant being so long  However I tend to disagree although it could be considered moot if you think about it in the right way, I think there are thing like clubs, they do not really count themselves as religios/spritual groups as they are more of a service to the community things like boy/girl scouts then are not self serving but help the children who attend grow into healthy humman beings, these groups are for the well being of mankind and are not exclusive by nature or design. Yes all religions are man made but then I wouldn't count zen as a religion, it's more classed as spirituality as it promotes oneness and harmony with the outside and internal world. This forum is open invite, and while I do not follow the wiccan section it's somthing I can happily accecpt it as what some people are into so maybe my definition of spirituality and religion differs slightly from the dicanory, in my humble opinion spirituality is the acceptance of the beliefs of others, while religion by design is to persicute those who do not accept it and be nice as pie to those who do. To use this board again as an example the people who frequent here are of a range of different beliefs, yet there is no arguing and bickering, as those who are here are interested in the spiritual aspect and/or definatly more open minded to others ideals and beliefs Although Crazy I strongly agree with your ideas that some of these groups where made with good intentions but (usually greed) somthing coruupted them, others where formed out of the need or want of power and control. But most of all "Be careful what you allow the media (the powers and principalities) to program into you minds." I find it strange that a source of entertainment can be used for such puropses. don't hate muslims I live with 2 and they are cool people. |
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Post by crazycat on Aug 13, 2006 5:41:55 GMT -5
Hey Blank, I wasn't downing spirituality. I'm big time into it. LOL! When I was thinking clubs..hehe.. I was not thinking about those little kiddy ones either ..no way. I think they are great. I had more in mind, clubs like the masons, skull & bones, and the many, many other of such as that out there. I have nothing against them personally. I've even belonged to one of those types for several years. It was called the Mayans and was similar to what the the Masons teach. My grandfather was a 33 degree Mason, as well. I have nothing against those eitherand not just because my grandfather was one. LOL! As far as spirituality promoting oneness and harmony, the christian religion I belong to for 15 years taught the same thing and did much good in the community. I have nothing what-so-ever against Muslims, Jew, Jehovah Winess, Catholic, Zen, Buddha, Hindu or any other. I am from a family that is a great mixture of many of those mentioned. We came very close to having a muslims added recently. Hehe!.... not only a mixture of belief systems but a mixture of the races, as well. I guess you could say, I from a family of mutes. The only thing I have against, is how the media has shown religion, especially the christian religion as someting foolish, stupid, and evil and the way it insinuates that it is the cause of all the world's problems. All I'm saying is that there is just as many spiritual people in these religious groups as there is in any other, whatever it is called. Quote: in my humble opinion spirituality is the acceptance of the beliefs of others, while religion by design is to persicute those who do not accept it and be nice as pie to those who do.In all those years that I was very involved in that christian religion, I never knew not one christain person who persecuted someone belonging to a different religions or group unless you call sharing their beliefs with another as persecuting. The ones I belong to had very caring, loving people, but of course I did not belong to all of them and there are hundreds of denomination out there and even within the same denomination there can be some bickering, but from what I've read on the net, there is bickering amongst some of those spiritual groups as well. What I tried to get across in that first post is that I don't see any difference in religious people and spiritual people esp. since religion itself is about spiriuality. The Christian religion isn't just about do's and don't (dogma) even thought there is some of that too. The christian religion I belong to was about being led & filled by the spirit/the Holy Spirit and living ones life in service to others. Loving your neighbor as your self. Your neighbor means all people, at least that is what I was taught. Hehe! If you have not seen how the media has not poked fun at the and put down the christian religion or christian people, you sure have not been watching the same shows and TV that I have. You talk about hating.... the way I see it, it is the other way around. There is much hating of the christian people and blaming them for what is wrong with the world. Isn't that why the people over in the middle east hate us so much, because they see us as a christian nation? From what I understand they don't see us as mixture of all religions and spiriual people that we are. They hate us because we care for the Jewish people the same as all the others. They even lump Jew and Christian as one and the same, which isn't so at all. I just really don't see where you could have confused me with hating some one, from what I posted. don't hate muslims I live with 2 and they are cool people. That statement makes absolutely no sense to me, unless just because I'm mostly christian it automaticly makes me someone who hates others in you eyes. Which is a very wrong absumption on your part. Actually, it makes me think that you didn't really read my long post, at least not very well for you missed my point by a mile or two . ;D Are you going to really read this one? Really hear what I am saying? |
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blank
Diviner
There is a little bad in the best of us and a little good in the worst of us
Posts: 258
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Post by blank on Aug 13, 2006 7:43:11 GMT -5
Oh the muslim statment was a general thing for people who read this thread, not trying to incinuate that you don't like them sorry about the misunderstanding.
Yes I think I get what you mean and might I comment that your experience of christinaty has been far different to mine, which I guess make you the lucky one. Had I ever been in a church like that without the blatent hyprocisy I might still be a christian... na no way. I also think that anyone who participate's in this forum is here for the purpose of furthering their sprituality. I reconganise the spiritual aspect to organised religion I find the dogma too restricting in the search for self, which I think is why I have divided spirituality and religion. Your experience of the church has been one of constructivness while mine has been destruction.
You have also unsettled me a little and now I must alter my thought patterns.....
Thankyou
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Post by crazycat on Aug 14, 2006 4:25:48 GMT -5
which I think is why I have divided spirituality and religion. Your experience of the church has been one of constructivness while mine has been destruction. I'm sorry you had such a bad experience with the christian religion. Hmmmm.... was it caused from the religion itself or from the people you were involved with that were practicing that religion? Who amongst us has not been a hypocrite at some point or another? Who amongst us have not made any mistakes what-so-ever? The only way one can recognize hypocrisy, pride, hate, lust... or even love, kindness, gentleness, self-control in another, is if you have experience that within yourself as well. As far as dogma is concerned, as long as a person is being led by the spirit within, one does not have to concern themselves with the law. Spirit is law. As long as you are yeilding to spirit in all your actions, you will experience love, joy, and peace, health....if your actions do not line up, you will experience fear, depression, sickness, shame, unrest.. It's really very simple. But of course you may still have some passed life karma to pay with sickness or pain or what ever..... that's where the gift of salvation comes in. Somehow I like that ideal..having one's slate wiped clean to begain anew without anything against... having that heavy load lifted gives a person new strength and hope. I didn't mean to unsettled you. I just have an agenda against the media using a means of intertainment in a corrupt way as sneaking their propaganda in to use mind control to control the masses. Makes one wonder just who is it and why they want the masses to believe there is a difference in religion and spirituallity. Whoever or whatever must be wanting us to stay divided and waring amongst each other. Why  is what I would like to know. I think it just might be those damn inorganics that invade our dreams and OBEs. Nothing but mind parasites living off our emotional energy. ;D Getting myself paranoid now! 
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blank
Diviner
There is a little bad in the best of us and a little good in the worst of us
Posts: 258
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Post by blank on Aug 14, 2006 7:00:54 GMT -5
it's not paranoia if their really after you.....
But seriously folks, if you are never unsettled you are never uncomfortable, if your never uncomfortable then there is never any need to change.
Fully understand what you mean by the media even in a country where our media is rather liberal you still must question that which you are told, life is rarely as it seems.
As for the gift (copout) of salvation... If there is a karmic debt on my ass then so be it I will pay my dues and live my life as best I can.
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Post by Dancing Bear on Aug 14, 2006 16:52:43 GMT -5
I didn't mean to unsettled you. I just have an agenda against the media using a means of intertainment in a corrupt way as sneaking their propaganda in to use mind control to control the masses. Makes one wonder just who is it and why they want the masses to believe there is a difference in religion and spirituality. Whoever or whatever must be wanting us to stay divided and waring amongst each other. Why is what I would like to know. I think it just might be those damn inorganics that invade our dreams and OBEs. Nothing but mind parasites living off our emotional energy. ;D Getting myself paranoid now! The media hasn't given me the opinion that there is a difference between religion and spirituality. Man who wrote and followed these religions has.. I am not saying all followers of religion are this way. But throughout history, Man has condemned those who do not follow the religion of the time.. Today we actually have the choice to believe or not.. But still Wars go on because one faith believes the other faith is evil... This is a centuries old conflict. I liked the statement because the way it was said , it was saying to me this outmoded way of pointing the finger and fighting over a belief system is ridiculous.. Being a spiritualist is having NO religion, and accept anyone who is nice and kind. It says alot about peaceful religions.. I think this is what he was getting at.. I too have had bad experiences with church going faiths. and more than one.. I found their beliefs are very confined to a box of instructions.. And living in a community that is full of church going Christians, I was one of the odd ones out, And i was definitely made to know this fact.. I have moved from this place and moved to a different state, We have more opened minded people here, but majority have congregated to certain areas, I am in the mainstream of living and still being cold shouldered because of the fact I read the tarot for the local women and men who have lost their way.. I am only full of compassion and enjoy what i do. even if it stuffs me up for days because the person i have read for has had a horrific life, and i can literally see the child within crying their eyes out. Sometimes it is so sad.. But regardless what i do, Still ignorance from the masses around me, still shun me because they believe because it is not acceptable as far as the bible is concerned, I obviously am doing Black Magic, the devils work etc..... So I think the statement that was originally posted was not meant to offend anyone who is religious at all.. It was saying all those cases out there that are similar to my own,( which are plenty) Enough is enough... Go beyond the books and educate yourself, walk in another mans moccasins before you hand down a sentence.. In todays day and age there should be more tolerance.. I personally accept anyone regardless of religion, sexual preference etc.. Unless they are just downright horrible. and I do get annoyed when others think they are Mightier than though. and it is mainly the Christian or catholic that do the shunning.. ( I am not saying all , just the majority i have encountered) It was my turn to be on my soap Box Crazy Cat.  |
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Post by crazycat on Aug 15, 2006 1:44:03 GMT -5
Thanks, Dancing Bear! I was hoping you would reply and give your point of view on this. And I am sorry that you had to tolerate such insults from a christian community. It is kind of ironic actually that christian's have such intolerance for people who practice Tarot for Tarot is the same as Kabbalah which was practice by the Judiah religion from the time of Adam and up and is still being practiced by the Jewish religion even today. The bible plainly states that Jesus did not come to do away with the law, but to fullfill it. The bible also teaches the difference in the use of the law for good and the use of it for selfish gain. To tell you the truth there is probably not too many christians who study the bible for themselves. Most are very ignorant of it and then you have the ones who derive meaning from it with there intellect only, rather than allowing spirit to help their understanding. There is a few verses that could indicate one should keep away form magicians, fortune tellers, and witches, and not have anything to do with them, but I see the interpretation of those verse as being taken out of context which changes their meaning big time. By the way, I did watch and enjoyed that movie. So what is your religion about? He replied I am NO religion. Religion divides people, I practice spirituality and Being Spiritual unites me with myself and Everyone else..To me that statement is an oxymoron. He is insinutes religion is bad because it divides people and then says spiriuality is good because it unites, which is a division in itself. He replied I am NO religion. I think I can safely say, that people who are lone rangers and do not associated themselves with any religious group believes religion to be only a bunch of rules/laws and have nothing to do with spirituality. I do not see that statement as saying he embraces them all, because of his next statement (Religion divides people). So to say he is No religion, he is saying he is above any rule or law that any one group of people has set up for themselves to live by. He is saying I am my own God with my own rules and I will not associate "join" myself with any group/religion that has set up a set of rules for the whole community to live by. So from that point of view he is the one that is causing division. Religions or any kind of group are set up to bring many people of one mind together and united them as one mind. It is only when one group has disrepect or something against another group that fighting and wars are fought. It is the problem that rose up between them that caused the division, not the group itself. It is a natural thing for groups that grow big, to end up with strife within because problems do rise up, usually by that long ranger who thinks his way of doing would be better. Thus a part breaks off and another group that teaches a different set of rules is set up. Of all the groups, the groups called "religion" are created by the spiritual leaders of a society and they are set up to teach spirituality to the masses in that society. If they teach something other than spirituality then they are no longer a religious group, but something else. Just because some group labels themselves as spiritual or religious doesn't make them so. I personally accept anyone regardless of religion, sexual preference etc.. Unless they are just downright horrible. and I do get annoyed when others think they are Mightier than though. and it is mainly the Christian or catholic that do the shunning.. ( I am not saying all , just the majority i have encountered) Sorry Dancing Bear, but I would have to go back to fact that you cannot see a trait in another unless that same trait is somewhere within oneselves. Granted it may be very deep down and hidden even from your own conscious self. You know the saying, "It takes one to know one". Not one of us escapes from that spiritual law. Hehe! That Creator God must have a really big sense of humor making us reflections of one another. ;D Next time one of those uppity christians ups their nose at you do something sneaky like stick some toliet paper to their back ends. Of course do it without them knowing. Hehe! I can just see a bunch of uppity christian out there tomorrow running around with toliet paper stuck to their butts.  |
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Post by Dancing Bear on Aug 15, 2006 6:27:57 GMT -5
Thanks, Dancing Bear! I was hoping you would reply and give your point of view on this.  I have seen a side to life that others would like to think you only end up there if you are a drug addict or a prostitute or worse. I am none of these nor have ever been...I see myself as having my eyes open and seeing things for what they are, and they are not my creation..I cannot control another persons reaction or personality.This has been part of my spiritual path to give me an understanding first hand so am am able to relate and help others... it is not because it is a part of me.... It has given me a compassion that is overwhelming at times.... If i walked around blind it does not mean all of this does not exist it just means i am blind... there is not a lot I don't see. Hehe There would be plenty LOL .. I honestly am not disturbed by it, , I just pray they see the "Real Light" (within).
I do beleive there are many many who are Spiritual who follow religion and also there are many many out there who are Spiritual without a religion...
I related to the quote in the movie in regards to the war in Israel and Lebanon really!!Thank you so Much CC I enjoy a good yarn |
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Post by elvinlady on Aug 15, 2006 10:01:40 GMT -5
I am very tolerant of other people's religions and beliefs. I feel you should be able to practice whatever you believe in and not be persecuted for it. My daughter is Wiccan and my son is pagan. I,myself, just don't believe in organized religion. I have had too many bad experiences with it. I believe in God or a higher power and that there are forces all around us that can be tapped into if you have the knowledge to do it. i believe there are things all around us that we can't see but we can feel and we know they are there and that once in awhile we can catch a glimpse of them. I really don't practice any kind of religion. I am just trying to find my way and learn whatever I can. I am very tolerant of anyone's sexual prefernce. My daughter is bi and I had a nephew that was gay. My daughter reads the Tarot and I would love to learn once I get a deck. I have seen the movie but it was a long time ago but I remember that scene quite well. It was a good movie.
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Post by crazycat on Aug 15, 2006 13:32:46 GMT -5
I see the good and the bad side of organized religion. I feel there is a need for it our society. Someone once said, "churches/religion is a spiritual hospital for the sick in spirit and there are alot of sick in spirit out there." If one is no longer sick nor feel a responsiblity to serve in one of those spirirtual hospital then there is no need for that person to attend. We all have our place and responsibilities. I'm not saying that all people who attend the religious organization are sick in spirit, for some or very healthy spiritually and are the ones tending the sick (spirual nurses and doctors so to speak). I would say a big percent are there because they are in trouble and in need of spiritual guidance and help or it may be that they are just spiritual babes. That is probably why one can see many fault and problems in such people. Each of us are on different levels on our journey. Hehe! I guess I could say I am of "no religion" for I have not belong to any religious group now for about 16 or so years. Dancing Bear, I feel I need to explain more about the fact that we are reflections of one another. It does not mean one has to have that trait in ourself in this lifetime, but was experienced in some other lifetime. From what I have read about reincarnation most of humanity has had many, many lifetimes and we have most likely worn the other guys moccasins at some time or another in one of those lives. You guys are the greatest. I would say that most of us here on this forum have set aside the childish things (spiritually speaking) and are no longer one of the spiritual babes in this world. Not saying that in any bragging sense, but for the fact that we were able to have such a discussion such as this one. |
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is what I would like to know. I think it just might be those damn inorganics that invade our dreams and OBEs. Nothing but mind parasites living off our emotional energy. ;D Getting myself paranoid now! 
I have seen a side to life that others would like to think you only end up there if you are a drug addict or a prostitute or worse. I am none of these nor have ever been...I see myself as having my eyes open and seeing things for what they are, and they are not my creation..I cannot control another persons reaction or personality.This has been part of my spiritual path to give me an understanding first hand so am am able to relate and help others... it is not because it is a part of me.... It has given me a compassion that is overwhelming at times.... If i walked around blind it does not mean all of this does not exist it just means i am blind... there is not a lot I don't see.