Damn Wars

[blank]

So what the hell is going on in this world Isaral and lebanon are blowing the crap outta each other.. well really Isaral blowing up lebanon and no-one has done anything Blair and Bush are arsing about and actually preventing the U.N from intervening what the hell.. some of you must have some thought on this

[Silver MoonWolf]

Well, most of the non middle east world backs Israel, especially the US as a large population of the US are Jews so that is kind of self explanatory why we would back them. On top of that you are talking about a war that has been going on between Israel and everyone else in the middle east for centuries and longer. We have tried to intervene before and the truces and cease fires have lasted for usually no longer than a few weeks at most before they start fighting again. These are holy wars pretty much and I doubt there is anything that anyone can do to stop them.

[Dancing Bear]

I know people in Israel and they are being bombed also, They are petrified. and making up their bomb shelters. I feel for the innocent citizens of Lebanon and Israel. who are trying to protect their families as best they can.
I do not think War is good for anything other than feeding the Ego of those in Power already.. Who gives a s*&t who believes in what....and whos got what. If we had a one united world we could all go to bed with full bellies, have a roof over our heads, & clean water.. I am sure their is a lot more we would benefit being united.. But with the di*#kH&%$ds we vote into Power we will never have it!!

[mandala]

It could be either (1) the U.S. and Britian are holding off hoping that Israel will eliminate or severly damage hezzbolah themselves so they won't have to get involved, or its (2) incompetence.

Judging from the current situation in Iraq, and the way the U.S government officials handled the aftermaths of hurricane Katrina, and the terrorists attacks from 9-11, I'm guessing #2.

[sxy]

These are holy wars pretty much and I doubt there is anything that anyone can do to stop them

yes,~ now it is being said so ...by everyone in the know..!

Israel did not start it and yet they have warned people in advance of retaliation-attacks,
... the Lebanese that are helping are civilian armies ,not innocent peoples.
... if they did not harbor evil terrorists , and stop bomb attacks maybe Israel would stop ,..but as you are not aware ,

... Israel has been told that "These holy wars " are to kill everyone in Israel ...! so guess what ? after they are gone !!! you are next on the list if you are Christian .....God Bless the Jews !


~SXY~

[Dancing Bear]

You know what annoys me though!
I am not a christian and yet am branded one because i live within a western culture.. I am no religion.A Japanese exchange student said to me "You Christians" I promptly educated him the fact even though we are Western culture we are many religions all living harmoniously so far *crossing fingers it stays that way*
These HOLY WARS are idiotic.I just cant wrap my mind around hating someone so much because of their beliefs, It is just so ludicrous I know these wars have been going on for centuries and probably will for centuries more but it still does not make it easier to understand.
I doubt very much they would achieve killing every Israelite. Everyone has been trying to wipe out the Jews for centuries and have not acheive it thus far,
The innocent I refer to are the Children.. I have seen images on Tv of young children badly wounded from both sides and it is just so sad! This will embed in their little minds for a long time.

[lonewhitewolf]

All I've been watching these past three weeks is the news. I just wish people would stop pointing fingers at each other. It doesn't matter who started the conflict. War sucks. I hate seeing any civilians get killed. I just wish this would end already.

[notamushroom]

Don't know why but this poem popped into my head as i was reading through this page so i thought i would go and get it and post it here.

First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the Communists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left
to speak out for me.

[mandala]

sxy said:

Israel did not start it and yet they have warned people in advance of retaliation-attacks,

Are you sure about that? Have you looked at the actual timeline? This current war started long before the capturing or (kidnapping) of the Israeli soldiers.

Hezzbolah made a statement yesterday that they would put down arms and negotiate with Israel when Israel stops the bombing. Guess what? Israel is still dropping bombs.

[Silver MoonWolf]

Short and simple is that Hezbollah wants Israel for itself and the Israelis are just defending theirselves. If anyone should be stepping up to end this thing it should be the lebanese government as the Hezbollah are a known terrorist organization and they are taking refuge in Lebanon. if Lebanon would step up and make them stop attacking Israel or remove them from the country this thing would not be going on as long as it has.

[Gav]

The history in that area of the world is harsh and complicated.

The Jews (Zionists) had been pouring into that area of the middle east with the (political) intention of peacefully securing a home land for centuries. In the mid 1800’s the Jewish population in the area outnumbered any other religion.

After world war one, Great Britain was handed the Palestine Mandate and so assumed ultimate responsibility for the nation, and were pro the establishment of a Jewish state, immigration into the areas increased due to the persecution of the Jews in Europe on the build up to the Nazi movement of 1939.

The real problems were created after the Second World War when Britain withdrew from Palestine giving up its mandate. The UN proposed the division of the then British republic of Palestine into two states, an Arab state and a Jewish state, a partition strongly opposed by the Arab population of the area.

The scene was already set with the Jews determined to form the independent state of Israel, and the Arabs hell bent on stopping them, when the British withdrew the last of its armed forces in 1948 the state of Israel was declared immediately by the Jews in accordance with the UN backed plan to partition Palestine.

The Arab-Israeli war broke out immediately with the constituent Arab nations invading Israel, they failed. And as a result were pushed back giving Israel control of a vast amount of land set aside for Palestine in the UN partition, the land was never recovered and Israel never withdrew, the infamous West Bank and Gaza Strip became the Arab territories.

Then came the refuges from both sides, Jews flooding out of Arab controlled areas to Israel and Arabs flooding out of Israel to Palestine, we are talking several hundred thousand refugees on each side, loosing everything and fleeing for their lives.

The trouble has never receded; the History of war goes on and on and not just with Palestine and Israel but with, Egypt and Israel, with Syria and Israel, in effect the Arab-Israeli war never ceased. I don’t see that it ever will.

There is only one way peace could ever be reached and that would be if Israel moved, which blatantly can never happen, the Israelis believe in their conviction to defend their homeland and quash terrorist attacks, the Arabs see Israel as an invading force in their territory, which to be fair they are, but they cant exactly up and go.

It’s a very sad and terrible vie, imagine the hatred that builds up on both sides, we are talking memories of family being killed, homes and livelihood lost.

The Palestine militants strike at Israel with terrorist attacks and Israel continually fight back with terrorist style attacks targeting civilians and infrastructure. There is no doubt in my mind that both forces are terrorists, the hatred builds every time another family is torn apart by the ‘war’.

Unfortunately the Jewish ethic of an eye for eye, indemnifies them spiritually from any recourse of the murder of civilians, and time and again they respond to militant terrorist attacks with terrorism deliberately targeting civilians and homes. The Arab extremists, at least the non Christian of them also work by the same ethic, due to religious direction they have no moral issues killing Israeli civilians. Every attack on Palestine creates more militants, and every attack on Israel creates more anger, and retaliation which once again damages more families and creates more militants.

Its awful, but its an endlessly cyclic situation, and truly likely to be the source of the next World War.

My heart goes out to the victims on both sides, who at the core, the mass majority of them, the non militants, just want to get on with their lives.

We can ask the question of why UK and American forces have not intervened, but then it is neither countries place to, in the end mandate of action comes from the UN not its individual constituent nations. The UK gave up Palestine after the Second World War no doubt an action to avoid having to police a nation that was just waiting to explode into war, to be fair the UK had seen enough war by 1945.

As a world power the UK does nothing without the say so of America, the NATO pact being the only thing that prevents the UK from being American. Tony Blair is blatantly a weasel of a man, and a puppet of the mighty US political machine. According to the news he was more concerned about taking his holidays than the trouble in the Middle East.

America arguably have a political and tactical interest in Israel as a middle eastern hub, so would generally, on a political rather than social level (ie the government not the people) be pro any Israeli action. We can of course read into this too far and come up with all sorts of conspiracy theories for ultimate plans for America to control the entire Middle East, be those conspiracies true, or based on paranoia.

We have to consider that if they were true then America would be pro an American peace keeping force, which they are not, would you want to stand between those two nations? As a political façade the policing of Middle Eastern countries is a powerful tool, it is good to be seen as world peace keeping force, policing all that need policing, the super heroes of the world, but a government soon loses the support of its public when body bags start coming home.

Unfortunately and ultimately the provision of foreign aid, and peace keeping military movements comes down to votes, money and political power. The foremost concern of any western government is staying in control of the country, which requires the approval of the voters; it is a sad, sad situation that the most powerful countries in the world, do nothing, not because they can’t, but because they don’t want to lose the next election.

True world peace will surely only arise after the total destruction of the world powers, the utopia of a united nations of the World is but a dream as no country is really willing to be absorbed and lay down to another, which is the only way a true one world nation could be achieved, by one Country taking complete control with the complete good will of all others.

Things will get worse before they get better.

Gav

[mandala]

In your last paragraph Gav, you sound like a supporter of a One World Government or New World Order.

The ideal does seem utopic, until you realize that human nature takes over, as does a few people who want to govern thier way. George Orwell, in his novel Animal Farm, illustrates this perfectly.

In short, there will never be peace on earth as long as human kind doesn't evolve to a more selfless and empathetic creature.

[Gav]

HI Mandela,

You are right it could be read that I came across that way; however my point was actually yours, more that it is an impossibility that unified peace could happen whilst we still have super powers guarding economic prowess and borders, a unified world could only come from all of the people uniting, in effect the abolishment of differing political and religious stances. Inevitably that would require one government, not a new world order, but a government of the people, if the people did not back the new government there would be no peace.

The only way we can ever progress to a true unified peace is if the people all agree to have peace.

It is sad that all it will take to resolve all conflict is humility, but so few are humble, so few have the opportunity to understand humility.

Kind Regards
Gav

[crazycat]

www.mayanmajix.com/art2601.html

I read this articles yesterday and this guys views on the situation puts it into a simplified form that's easy to understand.

If only something could be worked out without all going to war about it.

The following paragraph really saddens me. To think that the Christian religion is lumped in with this is totally against what it stands for in my view. Mainly because the Christian's God (Jesus) taught his people to go within and follow the spirit's guidance. He taught waring against your neighbor for any reason was wrong. Instead he taught them to love their neighbor as themselves and "their neighbors" here meant all the people in the world. He made that perfectly clear.

The majority of humanity is still basing its relationship to the divine on books, seen as holy scriptures, rather than on a direct experience of the divine presence. For the followers of such books the need to see their prophecies be fulfilled takes on an added importance as giving proof of the existence of God and the preeminence of one’s own religion. Holy scriptures were created in the National Underworld as human beings became partially separated from the direct experience of the divine and in a sense they have also served as a replacement for this experience, and this is the root of « religionism ».

I believe we as a whole/collective create our world. I suppose if enough people believe that another physical Armaggedon is to take place, they will cause it to be a reality. I believe it is a mis-representation of the book of Revelations to believe that this book prophecied about something of the physical to take place way into the future. I believe the whole book is about what took place spiritually within and physically with the man Jesus himself. The very first sentence of the books states that fact. The word revelation or apocalpse means unveiling or disclosure.The unveiling or disclosure of Jesus Christ which was to take place soon, not two thousand years in the future. The spirit had the person write the word "soon" in that sentence for a reason. "Soon" meant it was an event to take place in their time and it did, just as it was written.


It's really bad/sad that these three religions which all have the same source would come to such a conclusion. I can understand the Jew and Muslim believing this for they have not had their messiah/savior to appear yet, so to speak. But for the Christian religion to believe it is doubly sad, for they are the ones who are suppose to have the good news that all has been accomplished and the Kingdom of God is here with man now, not some time in the future, but instead they believed in some silly little girls vision and was lead astray. What is even more rediculus is that Jesus is supposed to have been the messiah for all the world/all peoples, which would do away with a "chosen race". His purpose was not to create another religion of supremacy.

All three are trying so hard to make the written word fit their beliefs rather than fitting their belief to the written word is the way I see it.
God help us all! It would be very sad if humanity has to do a repeat performance of the last 75, 000 year. Naahhh! That would mean Jesus failed!

I know a good solution to the whole thing. All of us who are of "no religion" should pray or direct all our energy each day for an earth quake or even better for a volcano to errupt at the Temple Mount so that none of them can have a Temple there. Or we all could pertition all our governments to use a smart nukes on that one spot that they are all fighting over and make it uninhibitable for the next 50,000 years or so. That way none of their prophecies can be fullfilled and then they can all move on to better things. It can be looked at like major surgery for our earth home. Remove the cancer and then healing will more likely take place, maybe. J/K!

Hehe! If we could get our hands on one of those big crystals like Michael posted about we could us that to amplify our energies to bring about a good solution. Just wishful hope, I guess.

But really the way we should be handling this world's situation is the way this person on the asc2k (David Wilcox) forum puts it:

..RA says "The Ascension is now."

....... Every day I wake up and feel grateful
and priveleged to be one day closer to the Harvest. Everything that is
happening around us really is part of the Divine Plan, we are leaving
the old world and entering the new world, hence all of this chaos and
destruction. The Negative Elite are holding on to what is to soon be
over, their strangle hold on humanity is drawing to a close. The 'Great
Awakening' as David calls it is really taking place and it fills me up
with joy that we are all part of it, doing our part, raising awareness,
and sharing in the love/light coming to Earth at this time. So as Ra
says, all the destruction, chaos, and death we see is not to be looked
at with fear, it is to be looked at as an opportunity to grow. "It is
not fair to categorize them as catastrophes, because within each crisis
lies opportunity." The catalyst we are enduring at this time are all
part of our personal and spiritual growth. Let us all reflect upon this
very special time in our evolution.

IN LOVE AND LIGHT,

~Jacob

[Gav]

Very insightful CrazyCat, the followers of each sect are indeed engaged in actions to ultimately full fill their own prophecies, I wonder if they realise that though?

Kind Regards
Gav

[blank]

Well unforntunatly it's unlikely that they will realise, as it's a conditioning that has been going on for thier whole life it give them purpose and hope. They probably know as much about the bible as I know about the koran, if i was found reading the koran as a kid I woulda had my ass kicked. oh well got to goto work.... tbc

[bezjak]

Yet I ask...how many prophecies have been fulfilled word for word from these "Holy Scriptures".....then in the same breath ask have you ever dreamed something that came to past? Warring over something written is folly. AND people as I see it there was only one "HOLY WAR", legend says the "Loser" reigns in hell now. The rest of the wars are "unholy", making blood sacrifice with those unfit for sacrifice. For they know not the reasons why they must kill......or die. (for what they have been told was based on lies.)