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Post by ~¤LilacSky¤~ on Mar 31, 2005 21:38:14 GMT -5
Hi guys I would like your opinions here, since no one realy knows for sure what they are and if they are real or not, I just want to know what you think..
thanks
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Post by Kosomot on Apr 3, 2005 14:23:15 GMT -5
Hi,
Well, I think we can't say that OBEs are illusions or they aren't real.
How can we judge that something is real or not?
If someone experiences, feels, sees something, then it's real for him. No matter if it happened in the physical, astral, or in his mind.
Even if OBEs were just halucinations (in which I don't believe), the memories from them would still be in the projector's mind. So he would treat them as reality.
And how do we know if our whole reality isn't an illusion?
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Post by ~¤LilacSky¤~ on Apr 3, 2005 14:32:48 GMT -5
thats true , we don't,..reality is something unique and differant for eyeryone I think, ..so perhaps we do create our own realties, however also to coexist with eachothers.
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Post by BenHangen on May 14, 2005 17:03:33 GMT -5
I have had an NDE and OBE’s and I wonder which way is which? Within each of us there is an internal model of the universe and I believe that all these universes are connected in the same way that we all see the one universe. This goes back to another thread about the holographic universe, most OBErs see a chord that connects them and to what? When one astral projects that is the holographic universe but then which way is the true projection? Are we the shadows of our true self or are we projecting from within?
I will agree with Kosomot in that we have created an illusion and call it reality. If what I have found isn’t real to everyone then I can not call it a reality I would be describing what I had found in terms of myself. The reality would still be unknown.
Are Obe’s Illusions? I believe this to be the world of dreams and illusions and the place where we try to describe reality to others.
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Post by nani on May 14, 2005 17:30:01 GMT -5
very well said, every sentence has a precious statement on its own..
foremost I appreciate this part:
I agree with `Shadows` yes. But Shadows with an implanted light-seed.
"which way is which".. thats really cool expressed and a very profound view at it.
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Post by astralanchor on Jul 31, 2005 21:50:07 GMT -5
Scientist from all around the world have discoveries at the same time and come up with the same resulting data, and when this happens they make it a law. I think that as OBErs, we're all coming back with the same resulting data (or similiar data), and we should also have laws.
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Post by nani on Aug 1, 2005 18:40:14 GMT -5
yes thats why it is so important to gather all informations of experiences in forums and in books, because once not so far in the future we`ll work together more and more with quantum-physicists and surely put up laws - or maybe even better said: explain the laws, the cosmic laws under which regularities we, everybody is living since ever anyways..
by the way I believe that will be the only thing and the first moment that finally something to the better in this world will be happening, cause religion is a kind of over and sciences, true sciences has not yet begann.. people dont know yet anything about "cause and effect" or what we call karma. But also not the "old" idea of karma, like the childish idea of punishment of an old grey god with beard, but just the natural logic of this divine universe, that nothing stays un-effected by anything, that everything is connected, that there are no holes nowhere whereto something, any feel, thought or action could disappear or abscond into - it just has to be seen all, digested and enlightened consciously. Oh its so nice to know all this, its comforting, but lol where to start first, with what to continue and when to finish, this endless earth-work-out? LOL lgn
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Post by ~¤LilacSky¤~ on Aug 2, 2005 12:08:27 GMT -5
I think some obes are illusions we create, however some are not...this is just what Ive discovered for myself..I think it really matters what state we are in and our level of awareness at the time of the obe..but you guys all know this as well..its very hard sometimes because the mind can be so powerful in creating illusions..
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odni
Conjurer
Posts: 152
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Post by odni on Aug 2, 2005 18:21:52 GMT -5
Yes Lilac, that would seem rational, since in some OBEs you might be in your room, but it is different...
So I think that this proves that obes are not on the same time-space plane as the waking state. But that raises the question, then where are they?
And how could you classify them as an illusion if you do not know?
Is not the concept of money an illusion? Gold and gems translated into paper numbers? The next time you go to an ATM, while you look at the screen can you see that on some electronic plane they are converted by ones and zeros into the same amount that will be reading on the paper soon laying in your hand?
And for this "illusion" we all live and die for?
Obes to me are real.
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odni
Conjurer
Posts: 152
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Post by odni on Aug 2, 2005 18:24:23 GMT -5
Dude, for a second I almost spoke like Yoda!
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Post by ~¤LilacSky¤~ on Aug 2, 2005 18:30:32 GMT -5
lol..odni..haha, and yeah I don't know what to think lol, Im confused..lol..and probably always will be until my time comes..but ya know, Im starting to think its all real..every bit of it..I know I sound confused lol, because I say so many things, its because I am constantly changing my thoughts about this, but now I say "its all real" because seriously it is, we feel/see/hear just as much in obes/dreams as we do in the physical..why can't everything the conscoius/sub soak up be real..I think that is how it is, if our mind can perceive it and translate the rest for us in sensations..I think its real..
matrix is a good example I suppose..
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blank
Diviner
There is a little bad in the best of us and a little good in the worst of us
Posts: 258
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Post by blank on Aug 3, 2005 8:25:30 GMT -5
OBE's are a different version of our filtered realility, if you've watched what the bleep do we know then you woulda heard this before. Our brain recives and processes approx 400 billion piecies of infomation every second, out of all that about 2000 of those bits actually reach our awareness. OBE's are as real as anything else in this world, my rational is that if it wasn't real why would you be able to interact with another traveller and why would they remember the experience as well?
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Post by ~¤LilacSky¤~ on Aug 3, 2005 10:59:01 GMT -5
true blank and I have looked for that movie...I can't seem to find it..and I want to see it badly.
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blank
Diviner
There is a little bad in the best of us and a little good in the worst of us
Posts: 258
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Post by blank on Aug 4, 2005 6:09:45 GMT -5
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mykodd
Seeker
"I pity the Fool who persists in the folly of comparing apples & oranges..." Mr T
Posts: 19
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Post by mykodd on Aug 4, 2005 20:48:27 GMT -5
interesting.
there is a common belief among eastern philosophies, that reality is an illusion,
and that we exist as part of "brama's dream" and won't be here when Brama wakes,
or merely in "the world of Maya (illusion)" where everything is a red herring,
and all our senses conspire to drag us away from our true selves.
therefore one could ask weither their astral experiance was just
another angle to veiw the dream we live in, Perhaps even a regular dream is too?
my owm experiance in this waking world, and in the sidereal world, are one and the same.
If you believe all the stories i tell that I say happend, or if you believe none,
It does not stop them being real , and in a universe I stand in the center of,
my veiw is paramount, as is yours in your universe.
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Post by ~¤LilacSky¤~ on Aug 9, 2005 9:25:31 GMT -5
thanks blank, and ya know I am starting to think its all "real" everything is real..because even in dreams we feel as much as reality, so to me I starting to think everything we engage in is real..this includes obe's /dreams...its all real.
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Post by goodboy on Aug 9, 2005 11:08:36 GMT -5
OBEs may very well be illusions (a form of communication) created by our minds to connect us to the greater network. I have a firm belief in a dream world, when we visit this world we create our own little world inside of the dream world and we can pass from one person's own little dream to the next. I have read about certain places to visit while experiencing an obe, so there could be someone or something that only exists in a separate reality and attracts us to their reality by giving us a "plot of land" to dream on.
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blank
Diviner
There is a little bad in the best of us and a little good in the worst of us
Posts: 258
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Post by blank on Aug 11, 2005 5:47:11 GMT -5
I'd be inclined to agree with you lilac, especially when you consider how unreal our "realility" is.
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Post by ~¤LilacSky¤~ on Aug 11, 2005 7:19:56 GMT -5
yeah Im starting to realy beleive what we create(pretty much everything) is real...
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blank
Diviner
There is a little bad in the best of us and a little good in the worst of us
Posts: 258
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Post by blank on Aug 12, 2005 4:59:51 GMT -5
i'd prefer to think if it as filtering the world out there to create the world we experience have you read the art of dreaming or is the online reading gonna be the 1st time?
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